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Is the Enneagram a Trojan Horse in the Church? With Marcia Montenegro—The Alisa Childers Podcast #81

10/4/2020

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The Alisa Childers Podcast · #81 Is the Enneagram a Trojan Horse in the Church? With Marcia Montenegro

Is the Enneagram a harmless personality test or is it something that could be spiritually harmful to Christians who use it? On today's video I talk with ex-Astrologer Marcia Montenegro, who is now a committed Christian about the New Age influence of the Enneagram and it's rapid growth within the church.

Links mentioned in the podcast:

Articles on the Enneagram by Jay Medenwaldt
The Enneagram GPS: the Gnostic Path to Self, by Marcia

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11 Comments

Robert Collie

10/5/2020 02:48:42 pm

I remember going to a 1970s workshop on Pyramid Power when I was in high school in San Antonio, TX. My memory is that it was a new age discussion on the use of pyramids to slow or prevent food from rotting - and the speaker, Dr. G. Patrick Flanagan, was selling books and a round copper embedded plastic disk, that he said held the same energy patterns as a pyramid. I bought both and still have the disk. The metal image on the front is an enneagram and the back has concentric circles that form a ying-yang pattern.

Bill (cycleguy) Grandi link

10/6/2020 08:48:54 am

Hi Lisa! Enjoyed this podcast. I hear of the "E" a lot on one of the Leadership podcasts I listen to. I almost decided to stop listening but every once in a while he has a guest I want to listen to. he and his guest are saying often "I'm a ___" what is yours? UGH! Anyway, I have shied away from the E because some of the research I have read by others put a check in my spirit. So thanks.

Also, your book arrived today from Amazon! I had it in my cart and pre-ordered it. I am almost finished with a book then I plan to read yours. (I don't do very well with more than one book at a time). :) I'm looking forward to it.

Jennifer

10/20/2020 10:56:03 am

I recently listened to this podcast and was saddened by lack of understanding surrounding the purpose of the Enneagram. I’d like to offer some clarity around the reason some Christians find it helpful from a fellow sister in Christ who has taken an in-depth look at the tool for years. The Enneagram is a tool that can reveal the specific ways we are held captive to our old self and helps us identify the exact places sin and brokenness make us fall short of the glory of God—those exact places that need the transforming presence of CHRIST. The idea is not to start looking more inwardly at the self than we are looking upwardly at the cross, but rather to identify those parts of ourselves that need to be cut away as part of the “old self” scripture tells us to take off. It indeed requires some careful inward reflection to do that and ultimately the goal of using this tool is to learn to die to “self” daily.

The Enneagram helps us take a look at why we are fearful, critical, need approval, are preoccupied with worldly success, selfish, angry, etc. for the purpose of submitting those vices to Christ and asking the Holy Spirit to change those habitual patterns in our lives. It’s not divorced from our walk with Jesus, but rather helps us make sanctification specific as it helps me identify those parts of my life that are still not surrendered to the Lord. There is nothing salvific about the Enneagram nor does it make such a claim. It is a tool and as such it does not transform us, but rather makes us aware of the things that need to be submitted at the feet of Jesus so HE can transform us more and more into his likeness.

The truth about the Enneagram, that anyone who takes a cursory glance will miss—including people are who are using it incorrectly, is that it’s actually saying you are NOT a number. The Enneagram is simply an examination of the false self of personality, a mask that you’ve unconsciously put on your whole life; a personality you've created, not God. We get the word “personality’’ from the Greek word “persona” which literally means “mask.” We are trying to get back to “poiema” which is what God calls us in Ephesians 2:10—his masterpiece or work of art. My personalty (or Enneagram number) has nothing to do with God’s “poima,” so it has to go. As a diagnostic tool, the Enneagram helps me see my personality with clarity. It helps me see all the problems of my heart so I can take them to the heart surgeon, Jesus Christ, for surgery. The numbers actually show us who we are NOT, but rather what needs to be SHED so you can live a more surrendered life in Christ and have more compassion for others. Both of these concepts are the heart of the greatest command.

Thanks for your time. For the record, I am not a progressive Christian. I believe in historical Christianity and I love God's word. I'm just a fellow believer that is trying to do what my God asked me to do; love him with all my heart, soul, mind and strength and love others. I'm trying to do that better, with more specificity everyday and the Enneagram has helped me do that more pointedly by showing me what I still need to work on. Thanks for listening.

Suzanne Asfar

10/22/2020 06:25:23 pm

Thank you, Jennifer, for the defense of the enneagram! Listening to Montenegro, I was having flashbacks to my conservative 80s upbringing that labeled and feared all things not in the Bible as “new age” and evil. As a former astrologer, her warnings come as fear-mongering about “unclean” things because it has been her own stumbling block. The whole earth is telling the glory of god, and that includes science, psychology, and the enneagram - whose truth encourage many believers on their journeys.

Alison

10/24/2020 12:50:48 pm

Hi Jennifer and Suzanne! Do you both believe that scripture supports your view that He will use pagan tools to set us free?

Nicki

11/16/2020 02:40:52 pm

Thank you so much Jennifer. This is so well worded.
This is exactly how I feel. The enneagram is just a tool that helps us see where we are missaligned with the gospel.

Paul S

5/4/2021 12:00:23 am

It is the role of scripture to point out the things in life that we need to shed and get rid of. Not the enneagram. Most of what you say could be said about many things. It sounds like you are importing a solid Christian worldview to the ennegram and then attributing what you imported as being exported from the ennegram. Someone else without a Christian worldview would get none of that from the ennegram, so those attributes are not inherit to the ennegram, but something that you see from your perspective.

People can use any tool (like a spoon or a knife or a words on a page) for good or for evil. We have to be careful not to worship the tool or to place too much value on it.

The Word of god has to be the foundation. Anything that distracts or subtracts from that (even subtraction by adding) is not good. It means those with a less solid foundation may be led astray.

Laurie

5/27/2021 10:48:34 pm

Paul S...AMEN!!!!!

Whitney Creath

10/26/2020 01:03:43 pm

The cross was most definitely a pagan tool, that God used for the good of all man kind.

Rob H

1/4/2021 08:32:04 am

Love this.

Paul S

5/3/2021 11:55:34 pm

The cross did nothing. Jesus' death and resurrection did everything. This may be a good analogy for the this discussion about the enneagram. If you follow the cross and place your faith in the cross, you don't gain salvation. You have to place your faith and trust in the one who died on the cross.

The enneagram may be a useful tool at certain times for certain people, but anyone placing too much trust, weight, or value in it will be disappointed. Any tool that brings us closer to God and his word means the tool was used for good. It does not mean the tool is inherently good. Origins do matter, but God can use anything for his glory, including pagan things.

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Is the Enneagram a Trojan Horse in the Church? With Marcia Montenegro—The Alisa Childers Podcast #81

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